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mahmoudmohy10
(@mahmoudmohy10)
New Member
LCD panel & UV LED life time

Hi Guys

I'm about to order  an "Original Prusa SL1 kit + Curing and Washing Machine BUNDLE" , however I've some inquiries:

  • Is the assembly of the kit easy; I mean Is there really a complete step by step guide that illustrates the assembly process?
  • What's the life time of both the LCD panel & the UV LED?
  • How frequently do both of them need to be changed?
  • Is it easy to replace them myself & How much do they cost?

Thanks in advance

Posted : 16/07/2019 9:46 am
Lichtjaeger
(@lichtjaeger)
Noble Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

There is not a single kit shipped yet. Only assembled versions.

Wait two weeks and maybe someone can answer some of your questions.

Posted : 16/07/2019 9:56 am
ClearMindCasting
(@clearmindcasting)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

The LCD panel will last, according to SL1 info page, a maximum of 500 hours of print time. 

I’d like to know what a replacement panel is going to cost and if there is the possibility of high resolution panels in the future.

Posted : 05/08/2019 1:56 am
paul.m27
(@paul-m27)
Honorable Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time
Posted by: clearmindmetals

The LCD panel will last, according to SL1 info page, a maximum of 500 hours of print time. 

I’d like to know what a replacement panel is going to cost and if there is the possibility of high resolution panels in the future.

500 hours?  I'm surprised.  I would have thought some of the prints would take 5-10 hours, which makes that 50-100 prints per panel.  That seems low.  Quoting from that page:

"The lifespan of the exposure display is a maximum of 500 hours of printing - the SLA 3D printing
a process on the Original Prusa SL1 is considered the standard way of using and wearing the original
display."

Also, "maximum of 500 hours" sounds like it will never go higher than that, but might be much lower.  

At 6 seconds/layer, .05mm layers, you have 3cm per hour.  A 20cm piece is ~7 hours.  90 of those per screen.  Replacement cost better be reasonable.  

I'm skeptical it is really that low or if they are being overly conservative for liability purposes.  I'm also curious about the failure mechanism.  If it is pixels stuck on or off, that could be an issue.  If it is hazing or decreased transmissiveness(word?) it might just lead to longer exposure times required.  

 

Posted : 05/08/2019 1:15 pm
ClearMindCasting
(@clearmindcasting)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

I just did some poking around and found that the replacement LCD panels for Photon printers is about $80CDN, so my guess is that Prusa panels will be a bit more, assuming the panel also comes with the aluminum housing already attached. If not then likely around that price point I’d hope. 

Posted : 05/08/2019 2:07 pm
paul.m27
(@paul-m27)
Honorable Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

I can handle that price point.  I guess it makes sense if it is based off of a commodity smart-phone screen.  

Any beta testers have 500 hours on theirs yet?  If you print 24/7, you could get there in ~3 weeks.

 

Posted : 05/08/2019 3:18 pm
Tooms
(@tooms)
Active Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

 

Can see the cost is 75€ / $90

https://shop.prusa3d.com/en/sl1/953-print-display.html

 

Anyone know if the printer is logging the hours-exposure-per-display in the menu, so it can be monitored how many hours it has worked and when it is time for an new display. ?

 

Regards

Thomas

Posted : 06/08/2019 4:25 pm
Kertch liked
ClearMindCasting
(@clearmindcasting)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

https://shop.prusa3d.com/en/65-sl1

 

I made a good guess, $74 USD is very reasonable. Trying to justify this to myself I just looked at the cost of a Form2 resin tray, around $160USD that only last for 4 litres of resin.. not sure how many tanks one would go through before hitting that 500 hour mark but it doesn’t matter. Even if you had to refit all of the printers internals you’d still come out ahead. 

Posted : 06/08/2019 4:40 pm
paul.m27
(@paul-m27)
Honorable Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

I can't see that link (no access).  Presumably only for beta testers or folks who's SL1s have shipped.

 

Posted : 06/08/2019 5:14 pm
ClearMindCasting
(@clearmindcasting)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

My printer hasn’t shipped yet, but I did order it awhile ago maybe my account has been recognized by the system. 

Any way, they replacement parts are up for SL1 and they’re are very very reasonably priced. 

Posted : 06/08/2019 6:20 pm
paul.m27
(@paul-m27)
Honorable Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

Ah, I can see them.  I was logged into the forum, but apparently not logged into the eshop so the link was dead.  I agree, reasonable prices.  I'll just need to order in batches so I minimize shipping cost to the US.  

 

Posted : 06/08/2019 6:27 pm
Foe
 Foe
(@foe)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

I found some info related to LCD mask lifespan, So It looks like the LCD is consumable ranging wildly from 1k hours to 400. Seems like LCD's are not made to withstand UV light very much, but in a way UV light destroys everything with enough exposure.

Zortax

https://support.zortrax.com/lcd-screen-replacement/

The LCD screen has a lifespan of about 400 working hours. This period highly depends on the type of resin you use most often. To ensure the highest possible lifespan of the screen, perform regular maintenance according to the

https://3dprinteruniverse.com/blogs/world-of-3d-printing/so-you-want-a-resin-3d-printer

For LCD 3D Printers the LCD itself is a consumable part. It has a lifespan of approximately 1000 hours of printing. Replacement LCDs run somewhere between $40 to $80.

...
Posted : 06/08/2019 8:31 pm
vintagepc
(@vintagepc)
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

I'm not surprised. This is what would kill blue LCDs in LCD-based projectors with metal halide bulbs, especially in cheaper designs with poor UV filtering. You can't filter it in an MSLA printer, so you're going to kill the LC material in short order. 

Posted : 07/08/2019 3:50 pm
paul.m27
(@paul-m27)
Honorable Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

Did anybody pick up what the failure mode tends to be?  Do pixels start getting stuck on/off, or does the whole thing just freeze up?  Is it something software detects through some test-mode, or do you just replace it once you've got a messed up print?

 

Posted : 07/08/2019 6:34 pm
vintagepc
(@vintagepc)
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time
Posted by: paul.m27

Did anybody pick up what the failure mode tends to be?  Do pixels start getting stuck on/off, or does the whole thing just freeze up?  Is it something software detects through some test-mode, or do you just replace it once you've got a messed up print?

 

From my projector experience, it degrades the liquid crystal material. You'll get severe ghosting and bleed when it simply stops blocking the UV light and/or is degraded enough that it slows down how quickly the state can change from clear to opaque. I don't think you can detect it electrically.

Posted : 07/08/2019 7:16 pm
Foe
 Foe
(@foe)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

I wonder at their LCD currently on their E-shop, because the metal LCD frame would be the most expensive component to manufacture would it not? If we are to replace LCD's at the end of their lifespan, would Prusa offer a frame-less version where all we get is the LCD pre-laminated with the glass and possibly become cheaper?

...
Posted : 07/08/2019 8:15 pm
paul.m27
(@paul-m27)
Honorable Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time
Posted by: daniel.k5

I wonder at their LCD currently on their E-shop, because the metal LCD frame would be the most expensive component to manufacture would it not? If we are to replace LCD's at the end of their lifespan, would Prusa offer a frame-less version where all we get is the LCD pre-laminated with the glass and possibly become cheaper?

I see your point, but given the fact that the LCD cracking appears to the the #1 problem they are having with reliability of the printer, I would suspect that there would be a high failure rate with folks attaching the LCD to the frame.  It seems a shame to waste the frame when the LCD goes bad, but I suspect returning it for reuse doesn't make sense as the part likely costs about the same as shipping from the US to Prague.

Posted : 07/08/2019 10:42 pm
ClearMindCasting
(@clearmindcasting)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

If/when I accumulate enough of them I’ll send them back so the aluminum house can be reused. Hopefully there could be some trade in program or something. 

Posted : 07/08/2019 11:16 pm
Foe
 Foe
(@foe)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

From the assembly photos and Prusa's brief explanation, they had to reinforce the back of the lcd with a piece of thick acrylic.

I don't know what Prusa intends really, but I feel that some parts of the LCD mask assembly look expensive to manufacture and would be difficult to replace because like many of us in other countries, it would be expensive to purchase and replace just through shipping costs alone, and it doesn't look as easy to reproduce even when it becomes open sourced designs.

...
Posted : 08/08/2019 1:07 am
ClearMindCasting
(@clearmindcasting)
Eminent Member
RE: LCD panel & UV LED life time

Is it a safe assumption to use the UV LED ON Time (or something like that) in the advanced setting as a measure for the LCD panels lifespan? Presumably the two parts work equally together right? 

Since the panels are out of stock I want to keep an eye on it and plan prints accordingly. 

Posted : 09/09/2019 11:45 am
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