Support needed on letters?  

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dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

Hi all,

 

My mk3s+ works great now and want to make some steps in designing with my kid.

 

So i have 2 questions:

 

- In what kind of tooling you guys are designing? 

For example, we want to design the pet bowl as attached. 

 

- In this attached example, does the letters need some kind of support?

 

Thanks!

Posted : 05/03/2021 1:39 pm
Swiss_Cheese
(@swiss_cheese)
Honorable Member

It printed, if your happy with it then I'd say no need for support.

Good Luck have fun : )

Posted : 05/03/2021 5:26 pm
Dan Rogers
(@dan-rogers)
Honorable Member

To make that bowl, it would be trivial in the 3D builder program that comes built into Windows 10.

Insert cylinder - change size to the dimensions you want for the outer bowl.

Insert cylinder.  Change size to the internal diameter and reduce the height to the bottom wall thickness.

Drag the second cylinder to sit within the first cylinder, with the top of the second cylinder centered and slightly above the now bottom cylinder.

Click the Edit tab with the second (top) cylinder selected.  Click the subtract tool.

Your bowl is now formed.

Now click Emboss.  Choose the font you want, think about turning off bevel, type in your pets name and hit the enter key or tab key to leave the text box.  Now use your mouse to position the emboss widget with your letters showing over the side of the bowl.  Click the size tool, and expand the text size on the bowl to the size you want.  From the size tool the Z controls how much the letters stick out or are embossed (negative) into the side of the bowl.

One last select of your now finished bowl model, click the object tab, then Settle.  Click the check box.  This seats the model on the bed.

Save your model, give it a name.  Switch over to Prusa Slicer.  Load your new model, position it on the bed and you know the rest.

Posted : 05/03/2021 6:22 pm
dma254 liked
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

Thanks Dan!

 

Questions:)

 

Inserted the second (bottom part) cilinder see attachement 1.

 

After this step:

 

Drag the second cylinder to sit within the first cylinder, with the top of the second cylinder centered and slightly above the now bottom cylinder.

Click the Edit tab with the second (top) cylinder selected.  Click the subtract tool.

 

I get attachement 2.

 

I am doing something wrong:)

 

 

 

This

 

 

Trying it, how

This post was modified 2 months ago 3 times by dma254
Posted : 05/03/2021 7:31 pm
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

Never mind:)

 

Did a crash course on fusion 360. Having some nice tools there! Its almost as we want so we can test tomorrow.

 

Curious about if the text will need support.....

Posted : 05/03/2021 9:21 pm
Dan Rogers
(@dan-rogers)
Honorable Member

Pretty darned good.  but what you need to do is change the sizes of the cylinders so they start to approximate the size you need.  The first cylinder becomes the bowl.  The second cylinder is going to be the hole in the middle that makes the solid disk a bowl.  Click on the sizing control at the bottom (arrows opposites) - that will let you adjust the x y and Z size of the part. 

For your second part, adjust the size of X and Y to be oh, 6 to 10 mm smaller than the first part.  That way they don't occupy the exact same size.  Which is what happened in your second picture.

I just went thru the steps.

Notice the sizing control is selected, and I have set the size of the bowl to be 220 by 220 mm round, and 90 mm high.

Here, I have the second cylinder defined as smaller than the outer edge of the bowl (200 x 200 x 80) and I grabbed the second shape and positioned it in the center of the first and slightly above the surface of the first.  Now I will click the edit ribon at the top and select subtract tool with the second cylinder selected.  That causes the shape of the second to be subtracted from the first, leaving the hole in the bowl.

Notice we're now left with a single bowl shaped object.  Let's click on the emboss tool, type in Fido and hit tab.  Then position and size the letters.  I chose to make my Z be negative 5.  If you make the emboss Z be positive, the letters stick out from the bowl. Otherwise they indent into the bowl.  Click the emboss check mark.

 

 

 

 

Posted : 05/03/2021 9:21 pm
Dan Rogers
(@dan-rogers)
Honorable Member

Fusion 360 - first year is free 🙂

 

Posted : 05/03/2021 9:53 pm
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

@dan-rogers

Awesome explanation! Will try in the morning again.

 

Thanks! Will update

 

Posted : 05/03/2021 10:23 pm
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

@dan-rogers

Dan,

 

Sorry, didnt worked for me with the windows 3d builder...Even with your perfect explanation...But thanks!!!

 

It worked for me on the fusion 360 tho!

 

Its printing the first test now, way to long i think, 11 hours! But lets see how its going:)

 

Thanks!

Posted : 06/03/2021 6:12 pm
fuchsr
(@fuchsr)
Honorable Member

An easy but surprisingly powerful tool is Tinkercad (Tinkercad.com). You should give it a try.

For anything more complex Fusion 360 is a good choice. It’s actually free, not just for the first year, as long as you have the hobbyist edition, which is totally fine unless you need advanced CAM/CNC capabilities or work with more than 10 projects active at any point in time (you can have an unlimited number of projects, but only 10 active at any point in time). Yes, the website says 1 year, but it will auto-renew — unless of course the Autodesk Gods change their minds… But for now they have committed to keeping the personal use/hobby license free.

Posted : 07/03/2021 1:52 am
dma254 liked
Dan Rogers
(@dan-rogers)
Honorable Member

@dma254

Understood.  3D builder is kind of finicky and takes some practice and then more.  Very glad you got going with your kid! 

 

Posted : 07/03/2021 2:10 am
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

First result! Think letters need support to make it perfect 

This post was modified 2 months ago by dma254
Posted : 07/03/2021 11:18 am
Swiss_Cheese
(@swiss_cheese)
Honorable Member

You might try a little less emboss first, from your images it really doesn't look to bad, at least not as bad as the clean up from prusa supports would look. making the emboss a bit shallower might take care of the places where your over hangs are barely failing. another way that can be compensated for is but doing a selective layer adjustment in those areas, increasing the number of layers just in the areas that need support, In short I would try everything else before adding supports.

Good Luck,

Swiss_Cheese

Posted : 07/03/2021 6:11 pm
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

Thanks swiss!

 

Just finished a print with support. Thats not going to work:) we will print about 30 for a animal shelter, too much h work to remove support, and not nice result at the end.

 

What do you mean by shallower? My English scks sometimes:)

 


 

Posted : 07/03/2021 6:57 pm
Swiss_Cheese
(@swiss_cheese)
Honorable Member

@dma254

What do you mean by shallower?

I mean try making the letters stick out less. for example, if they are protruding 3.17mm try making them at only 2mm deep. if that doesn't sort you out then try adding a very slight bevel to them, doing this will allow the layers to be added while being supported by the lower layers almost inperceptively, this is what is known as tuning the model.

 

Posted : 07/03/2021 7:28 pm
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

@swiss_cheese

They are 2mm now already.

With bevel you mean using the filet or chamfer tool? 

Posted : 08/03/2021 6:03 pm
Dan Rogers
(@dan-rogers)
Honorable Member

Do be aware that these prints will likely NOT hold water, and are probably not long term safe for serving food in.  The issue is the spaces between the filaments can get contaminated, you might want to think about coating them with a food safe epoxy.  For the price of bulk dog-bowls that are perfectly safe for the dogs, you sure are chewing up a typically expensive filament for an application that it really should not be used for without significant post processing to make them food-grade-safe.

Posted : 08/03/2021 7:58 pm
dma254
(@dma254)
Active Member

@dan,

 

There will be something in it:) Dont know the English name, see attachment.

This post was modified 1 month ago by dma254
Posted : 08/03/2021 8:18 pm
fuchsr
(@fuchsr)
Honorable Member

I agree with Dan, I would coat it with epoxy. Take a look at this Prusa blog post that looks at food safety in 3D printed models: https://blog.prusaprinters.org/how-to-make-food-grade-3d-printed-models_40666/ .

Even though you put something inside, the outside will still collect crud. I have 3 dogs, I know…

So unless this is purely for decorative purposes, I’d be inclined to coat it, to be on the safe side.

Posted : 08/03/2021 11:21 pm
Swiss_Cheese
(@swiss_cheese)
Honorable Member

@dma254

I didn't know what depth or size any of the model is, I was just using a hypothetical example, when I look at the images you posted of your prints it appears that you could reduce the amount that the letters are sticking out and still have a nice effect and maintain the detail you appear to be looking for, and yes, With bevel I mean using the filet or chamfer tool not to round the outside of the letters but to ease the transition from the bowl to the letter, so you don't have 90 degree over hangs.

Posted : 09/03/2021 1:40 am
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