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7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer  

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GuyH
 GuyH
(@guyh)
Eminent Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

If you're not prepared to fault find by checking electronics then there's no point the result of us speculating.  Best to close the thread and take your voucher from Prusa.

Posted : 10/07/2021 10:31 pm
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

@guyh

I have to concur.  As long as it prints, I am happy with all of my Prusas.  I have never paid much attention to the speed.  

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 10/07/2021 10:53 pm
TwoBallScrewBall
(@twoballscrewball)
Trusted Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer
Posted by: @lolo

I just look at video again and notice that bottom printer has PINDA lights on when moving and upper printer PINDA light off.  If I'm correct lights should be on when metal (bed) is not detected and off when detected.  Could be wrong wiring?

This was a great catch!!! I had not noticed that, but you are right.  The fast printer, the light stays lit at all times, until the probe is being done when it blinks off.   On the slow printer, the light is off, then blinks on and off during probing.   That is a difference that Prusa supprt, nor I, had caught.   Thank you for that reply!!

Posted : 12/07/2021 11:27 am
TwoBallScrewBall
(@twoballscrewball)
Trusted Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer
Posted by: @guyh

If you're not prepared to fault find by checking electronics then there's no point the result of us speculating.  Best to close the thread and take your voucher from Prusa.

Who said I'm not prepared to check electronics?   All I said, was that I didn't want to pull apart the wiring on the working printer to start part swapping things into the other printer.   Thanks for a useless reply.   Guessing you were in a bad mood.

Posted : 12/07/2021 11:28 am
Lichtjaeger
(@lichtjaeger)
Noble Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer
Posted by: @twoballscrewball
Posted by: @lolo

I just look at video again and notice that bottom printer has PINDA lights on when moving and upper printer PINDA light off.  If I'm correct lights should be on when metal (bed) is not detected and off when detected.  Could be wrong wiring?

This was a great catch!!! I had not noticed that, but you are right.  The fast printer, the light stays lit at all times, until the probe is being done when it blinks off.   On the slow printer, the light is off, then blinks on and off during probing.   That is a difference that Prusa supprt, nor I, had caught.   Thank you for that reply!!

Could it be that the printer on the bottom is an MK3S and the one on the top is an MK3S+?
You can see the difference at the PINDA plug. The PINDA V2 has 4 wires, the SPINDA only 3.

Posted : 12/07/2021 11:38 am
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

@lichtjaeger

Then it would seem they are not the same printer as indicated initially.  

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 12/07/2021 11:55 am
TwoBallScrewBall
(@twoballscrewball)
Trusted Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

They are both MK3s+ models for sure.   

Slow printer was shipped December 11th 2020, purchased on the black friday sale.   Faster printer was shipped May 7, 2021. 

Posted : 12/07/2021 12:29 pm
Lichtjaeger
(@lichtjaeger)
Noble Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

Please do me a favour and check the plugs.

Posted : 12/07/2021 12:31 pm
TwoBallScrewBall
(@twoballscrewball)
Trusted Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

I did 🙂  Both are 3-pin plugs.  Both have a "Superpinda" label on them.   The plugs are keyed, so they can only plug into the Einsy board one way.   There is no obvious damage to any plug. 

Posted : 12/07/2021 12:37 pm
Lichtjaeger
(@lichtjaeger)
Noble Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

Too bad. Hoped it would explain the inverted light signal.
Maybe the first batch of SPINDAs (December and January (mine is from January)) had some issues and meanwhile it is fixed.

Posted : 12/07/2021 12:42 pm
TwoBallScrewBall
(@twoballscrewball)
Trusted Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

I should have the new SPinda by the end of the week so I will let you know if that fixed it 🙂

Posted : 12/07/2021 12:45 pm
Peter in Katy
(@peter-in-katy)
Estimable Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer
Posted by: @twoballscrewball
Posted by: @lolo

I just look at video again and notice that bottom printer has PINDA lights on when moving and upper printer PINDA light off.  If I'm correct lights should be on when metal (bed) is not detected and off when detected.  Could be wrong wiring?

This was a great catch!!! I had not noticed that, but you are right.  The fast printer, the light stays lit at all times, until the probe is being done when it blinks off.   On the slow printer, the light is off, then blinks on and off during probing.   That is a difference that Prusa supprt, nor I, had caught.   Thank you for that reply!!

Knowing this, try raising the pinda on the slow printer.

There may be something in the firmware that slows everything down when the pinda shows the nozzle near the bed.

 

Posted : 12/07/2021 11:10 pm
Kaskade911
(@kaskade911)
Eminent Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

Hi @twoballscrewball,

I bought my two MK3S+ printers on the same time (11/2020 and 5/2021) and I have the same issues!!!

11/2020: slow while mesh bed leveling
5/2021: the fast guy!

I just spend 1,5 hours with the PRUSA hotline with no findings...

The SPINDA LEDs are blinking fast and slow similar to yours - but when the probe is away from the bed the LED is on and vice versa on both printers.

IMHO, the reason for faster blinking is the much faster movement of the Z axis...

I measured the distance: SPINDA tip - smooth sheet:

slow one: 1,2 mm

fast guy: 1,6 mm

Is this the reason?

I'm looking forward to the next ideas

 

Have fun Kaskade911

Posted : 13/07/2021 8:28 pm
ROSLAN
(@roslan)
Active Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

Hey guys, I have the exact same problem. One MK3+ is doing very fast probing, the other not so. However one of my MK3+ was, in his earlier life, a MK3 and I upgraded it. So it has an older Einsy and LCD PCB. That may be one of the reasons for me.

Posted : 14/07/2021 7:58 am
Kaskade911
(@kaskade911)
Eminent Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

I made some measurements to have more informations on the SuperPINDA probe.

I measured the Z axis travel (LED off -->LED on --> LED off) to investigate the hysteresis "distance". The hysteresis is different on both.

old (11/2020)/ slow: 0,30 mm

new (5/2021)/ fast: 0,16 mm

During the MBL procedure, the SPINDA is lowered and raised between the LED off and LED off (--> blinking) positions.

With the approx. double hysteresis value, the time intervall per level point is as well doubled...

IMHO this is one step to the different behaviour but may not fully explain it. 😐

PS: The EINSy boards are 1.2b on both printers

LG Kaskade911

This post was modified 5 months ago by Kaskade911
Posted : 14/07/2021 10:02 am
Kaskade911
(@kaskade911)
Eminent Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer
Posted by: @roslan

Hey guys, I have the exact same problem. One MK3+ is doing very fast probing, the other not so. However one of my MK3+ was, in his earlier life, a MK3 and I upgraded it. So it has an older Einsy and LCD PCB. That may be one of the reasons for me.

When did you buy your SPINDA probe?

It seems very likely that the probe can be blamed for the different behaviour.

New (2021) SPINDA probe --> fast ???

Old (2020) SPINDA probe --> slow ???

Posted : 14/07/2021 10:13 am
lolo
 lolo
(@lolo)
New Member
RE: 7X7 Mesh Bed Leveling much faster on new printer

Please read next two article. Then maybe we can consider if problem is with SPINDA or its related with some other problem.

Mesh bed leveling

P.I.N.D.A./SuperPINDA Sensor testing

Posted : 14/07/2021 6:31 pm
Kaskade911
(@kaskade911)
Eminent Member
links

 

Posted by: @lolo

Please read next two article. Then maybe we can consider if problem is with SPINDA or its related with some other problem.

Mesh bed leveling

P.I.N.D.A./SuperPINDA Sensor testing

Hi lolo,

THX for the links. I was not aware about the magnetic "compensation" when using 7x7 MBL and the option to change Z probe counts.

But nevertheless, on both printers I use 5x5 MBL, 5 Z probe samples and no magnetic compensation. But with my investigations regarding hysteresis, the SPINDA comes into the focus.

And as I'm not yet in the mood to tear down two fully working and calibrated printers, I wait for the results of @twoballscrewball. Its a breeze to do this with a separate SPINDA...

Regards Kaskade911

Posted : 15/07/2021 10:21 am
TwoBallScrewBall
(@twoballscrewball)
Trusted Member
Topic starter answered:
FIXED!!!!

Thanks to all that replied.   The new SuperPINDA arrived yesterday and I just tested it.   Problem is completely resolved, as seen in the video below.   

FIXED!!!!!  Now I just have to route the new PINDA wire properly. 

 

Posted : 20/07/2021 11:57 am
Ringl
(@ringl)
New Member
Lowered Speed of SuperPinda

Having the same "problem" coming from a MK3S to MK3S+ Upgrade (ordered end of june and received beginning of juli, assembled last weekend, so it should be the latest) and finding it quite irritating. Had an email-conversation yesterday with Support which told me that´s correct to have the SuperPinda at lowered speed to offer "great precision and stable nozzle height". Had this thread included in the conversation pointing out that it seems some people like Twoballscrewball having not lowered speed with SuperPinda vs. old Pinda, they are looking into it finding the culprit of this...

I suggested they should mention this slower behaviour of the new SuperPinda at least in the assembly instructions for the MK3S to MK3S+ Upgrade as other people may stumble on this too...

 

Posted : 22/07/2021 9:15 am
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