Nothing wants to stick (brand new machine)  

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angus
(@angus)
Active Member

First time poster and user 😀, finished building and went through all testing all is good. completed first layer calibration and its been hit and miss on the adhesion, I don't think I have had the entire test pattern ever stay on the heatbed. I have adjusted to what I think is close on the Z axis and currently sitting at -.8  I have gone lower (been as low as -1.3) but it appears to be too flat and bundles. I have increased the bed temperature as well as nozzle temperature but same issues. Its like the bed is a Teflon frying pan and nothing will stick 😖 

I'm sure this has been asked a dozen times, filter through the forum but can't find a solution. using Prusa filament that came with the unit.

 

Thanks for reading and any suggestions

 

Angus

Posted : 05/06/2020 4:43 am
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member

Post your Z calibration print, please.  Post it on the plate and the a picture of the backside of the rectangle.  This is likely a Z level issue.  

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 05/06/2020 10:21 am
Graham
(@graham-2)
Trusted Member

One good way of getting a "new" plate is to give it a good scrub in hot water, with some washing up liquid.

this is always best to do. As Charles says sounds to Z related

one point i have had my printer in bits over the last day,came to print had to re do all the calibrations and z heights that use of 3 different plates.

was quite different in z height too what i was using before, all sorted now but was very frustrating to say the least

Posted : 05/06/2020 11:46 am
Andy Stuart
(@andy-stuart)
Active Member

Hi,

I am the same with a brand new machine, all the calibrations went through and all ok but I have exactly the same issue, and have done the same as the previous poster, please see attached my pics.

[caption id="attachment_33733" align="alignnone" width="600"] Initial laydown of filament at first layer calibration[/caption]

I have tried various heights from 0.6 to 1.1 but none of them stick at some point in the calibration process. I did have a bit more success this morning between 0.65 to 0.8 but none of the returns were square and once you got to the box to fill in nothing stuck and built up on the nozzle.

 

Posted : 05/06/2020 12:09 pm
Graham
(@graham-2)
Trusted Member

Hi

can you tell me what you cleaned the plate with? to me it looks like something has been left behind in the cleaning

as i have said in my last post, a good scrub in hot water.

i use IPA to clean, but sometimes i will use a good kitchen spray

from the photos, to me it still looks to far away from the bed

 the Z height is only a number for YOUR printer, i have gone from .7612 to 1.237, quite a change.

this was because i had it all in bits to replace a bearing on the X 

I would try to lower the Z, i was in the same pace as you to start with i was afraid to adjust the Z even a small amount in case i messed up the printer some how, sill really!

once you become familiar with adjusting Z it makes life so much better, wish my Ender 3 had it it is such a pain to get that one right

 

Posted : 05/06/2020 1:03 pm
Andy Stuart
(@andy-stuart)
Active Member

@graham25fox

Hi Graham, Since I posted those pics I saw your first post and have went and gave it a good clean as you mentioned but I am still having the same issues. I had given it a good wash previously, think what you are seeing is streaks from giving it a clean when the plate was still warm.

What is IPA? (apart from beer!), I noticed on another post somewhere or maybe online that methylated spirits cleans it as well so I was using that too.

I am still trying and lowering the Z very time, down to 0.850, now getting the first return sticking but when it gets to the second one its pulls it off again.

 

Posted : 05/06/2020 1:23 pm
angus
(@angus)
Active Member

How do I add pictures, a little different forum than I’m used to 

thanks 

Angus 

Posted : 05/06/2020 7:14 pm
angus
(@angus)
Active Member

My issues are identical to Andy-Stuart’s 

Posted : 05/06/2020 7:18 pm
Graham
(@graham-2)
Trusted Member

Hi  IPA is Isoproanol, or in some countries rubbing alcohol 

 

Posted : 05/06/2020 7:23 pm
Bunny Science
(@bunny-science)
Noble Member

Failure to stick on first print is one or more of these three things in descending order of likeliness.

1. Plate has not been washed with Dawn (dish soap WITHOUT emolients/scenting) and rinsed with a lot of water. This should be done to remove factory residue. Never touch plate surface with fingers after washing. Dry thoroughly on heat bed for a few minutes immediately after washing.

2. Live Z is holding nozzle too far up. If using Prusa calibration line, lower Z until you see the height of the deposited line is squished down to be 1/2 the width of the line.

3. Bad spool of off brand filament and super wet good spool.

 

Posted : 05/06/2020 7:47 pm
Graham
(@graham-2)
Trusted Member

Just thinking,

what was the print you are try to do, was it the prusa calibration?

i must say that i find it too thin and did not stick very well even when you have a well calibrated printer.

How about going on thingyverse and getting a simple bed level or even a 20 mm calibration cube, i have used the Whistle as a good test.

that way you are cutting out the slicer and not getting any more errors

this way you should have a good foot print to start to get idea of what a good first layer should look like.

What slicer, are you using?

Recently most of my printing is in PETG.

I was having problems with sticking well early on with PLA. But went to 70c on the bed 

Cant really understand why it is picking up the second layer, it may be your line width is not set right,and just not putting enough filament through. should be .4 mm

will keep thinking about this and will post some thoughts later

Graham

 

Posted : 05/06/2020 7:48 pm
jsw
 jsw
(@jsw)
Noble Member
Posted by: @angus

How do I add pictures, a little different forum than I’m used to 

thanks 

Angus 

Use 'Add Media' and either upload from your machine or link on the web.

Posted : 05/06/2020 8:02 pm
angus
(@angus)
Active Member

Thanks JSW, that was easy.

this is one of the best test calibrations I've got

thanks

 

Angus

Posted : 05/06/2020 8:06 pm
angus
(@angus)
Active Member

I've tried the whistle on the SD card but not much better, I did a test with PETG  it was a bit better but no projects to print yet as the SD card only has PLA and the temps are too low, not sure if I can increase them, possibly just through the tune up menu?

Thanks

Angus

Posted : 05/06/2020 9:24 pm
jsw
 jsw
(@jsw)
Noble Member

Yes, you should be able to tweak the temperature of the nozzle and the bed from the LCD settings menu.

I once had a pre-made .gcode for PET but wanted to use PLA, so I just dialed back both at the start of the print. It worked fine.

Posted : 05/06/2020 9:28 pm
Andy Stuart
(@andy-stuart)
Active Member

@angus

Hi Angus, I am using an iMac so I took the photos with my I phone, uploaded them to my photos album and then I pulled them over to a hard drive, once they were there I went to the add media button (above right) and just pulled them over and added some info to them in the description box which appears on the right hand side, then click the add to post button at the bottom right hand corner and that will add it to the post.

I would expect windows will be the same, once you have the pics in a folder I would think you would be able to pull them over.

Cheers

Andy

 

Posted : 06/06/2020 8:57 am
Andy Stuart
(@andy-stuart)
Active Member

@angus

hi Angus, I had one exactly like that, another couple of tweaks in the height gave me the right calibration, my perfect height is 1.085.

Thought I was away then had my tea and came back, then it took me 14 goes at the 1.085 height again to get the first layer calibration complete to the above pic again.

I have tried the prusa badge and thought I was sorted but when it started printing the letters it disbonded again, tried a couple of others but the first layer wasn't sticking.

Since the above I have tried the First layer calibration this morning (06/06/20) and it completed it first time, although I did preheat the bed, off to try the prusa badge again!!

Cheers

 

Andy

Posted : 06/06/2020 9:05 am
JoanTabb
(@joantabb)
Moderator

Hi Folks

Have you tried washing the build plate, 
I use  a little dish soap  Clean kitchen sponge and HOT WATER, in the sink, Scrub well with a new kitchen sponge, rinse well with hot water, and dry immediately.

Keep your fingers off the face of the build plate and use 70C for the bed temperature (For PLA) 

best wishes, 
Joan

I try to make safe suggestions,You should understand the context and ensure you are happy that they are safe before attempting to apply my suggestions, what you do, is YOUR responsibility. Location Halifax UK...
Posted : 06/06/2020 10:17 am
Andy Stuart
(@andy-stuart)
Active Member

@joantabb

Hi Joantabb, yes I did do that, at first it had a detrimental effect as nothing would stick, only after a few tries did it start to stick again, I'm trying the change in temps. as I see that as the issue (or one of them), so will tweak them and hopefully that'll do the trick.

Thanks again.

Andy

Posted : 06/06/2020 12:07 pm
angus
(@angus)
Active Member

Thanks Joan, I did raise the temp to 65deg, felt I had better results, I did measure the temperature on the build plate with a thermo laser gun and it was reading 55 degrees at a 60 deg setting

ISP is almost impossible to find around here at 90 percent, 70 percent is all that is available. I did the dish soap and very light scrub pad ( the one you have shown) but a little reluctant to scrub hard. 

I think I have the thickness correct, temperature and cleanliness is my challenge ( I think ) even though I think its clean and hot 😐  

Posted : 06/06/2020 4:02 pm
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