Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge
 
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For Science!
(@for-science)
Active Member
Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

Just going to leave this question in case somebody who knows stumbles upon it later. I see the Prusa XL having a benefit of not needing to print a wipe tower, but I wonder whether the speed of the tool change followed by offset calibration will be faster than the average filament change and purge block printing. The promo video seemed to advertise the ease and accuracy of the tool changer, but I guess if its very slow, my prints that are bottlenecked by frequent filament changes will still take a similar amount of time to print.

Posted : 22/11/2021 2:51 pm
Saij
 Saij
(@saij)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

As it looked in the video you only need to calibrate the offset one time. At least the calibration knob was placed directly on the heat plates and not on the print surface.

Posted : 22/11/2021 2:53 pm
For Science!
(@for-science)
Active Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

Yeah in the video it does look like that. Perhaps, they are very confident that the tool gets picked up and dropped down exactly the same way every time. I had interpreted it as a demonstration and actually there is going to be a calibration point somewhere in the machine that it has to touch after each tool change. 

I guess even if it isn't calibrated every tool change,  the question about how much faster it is compared to the MMU2S is still valid 😛

Posted : 22/11/2021 2:59 pm
MileHigh3Der
(@milehigh3der)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

It looks like the Prusa and e3D core xy heads are different tech, but the Core system was accurate to a very high degree- I’m forgetting the way that they measured it, but for us, it was basically zero drift.

Faster than an MMU?  Does that include manually having to fix it every few layers?

Posted : 22/11/2021 6:24 pm
boris.g5 liked
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

The tool changer will be substantially faster I am pretty convinced. It will be even massively faster when you print at low layer heights, where nozzle flushing takes forever and also wastes obscene amounts of filament.

Posted by: @for-science

Just going to leave this question in case somebody who knows stumbles upon it later. I see the Prusa XL having a benefit of not needing to print a wipe tower, but I wonder whether the speed of the tool change followed by offset calibration will be faster than the average filament change and purge block printing. The promo video seemed to advertise the ease and accuracy of the tool changer, but I guess if its very slow, my prints that are bottlenecked by frequent filament changes will still take a similar amount of time to print.

 

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1...
Posted : 22/11/2021 9:55 pm
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

If your MMU is well dialed in, you don't need to manually intervene. Printing with soluble support can be nastier though but even that can be printed with few if any interventions with the right materials and settings.

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1...
Posted : 22/11/2021 9:57 pm
For Science!
(@for-science)
Active Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

On average I have to intervene with my MMU2S every 30 hours or so, so its only really annoying when it happens when I'm out of the office. I'm sure the tool changer will likely have teething problems too, we'll see.

Posted by: @milehigh3der

It looks like the Prusa and e3D core xy heads are different tech, but the Core system was accurate to a very high degree- I’m forgetting the way that they measured it, but for us, it was basically zero drift.

Faster than an MMU?  Does that include manually having to fix it every few layers?

 

Posted : 22/11/2021 10:43 pm
boris.g5 liked
For Science!
(@for-science)
Active Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

This would be great as that is my main use-case! 

Posted by: @thejiral

The tool changer will be substantially faster I am pretty convinced. It will be even massively faster when you print at low layer heights, where nozzle flushing takes forever and also wastes obscene amounts of filament.

Posted by: @for-science

Just going to leave this question in case somebody who knows stumbles upon it later. I see the Prusa XL having a benefit of not needing to print a wipe tower, but I wonder whether the speed of the tool change followed by offset calibration will be faster than the average filament change and purge block printing. The promo video seemed to advertise the ease and accuracy of the tool changer, but I guess if its very slow, my prints that are bottlenecked by frequent filament changes will still take a similar amount of time to print.

 

 

Posted : 22/11/2021 10:44 pm
MileHigh3Der
(@milehigh3der)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

I could still see a need for some kind of priming tower, especially if you are using one extruder for exterior perimeters.  You really need to have that putting out consistent material from the start.  Infill extruders, or one that are doing some infil, not as critical.   It wouldn’t need as much extrusion as a color change, just enough to make sure what might have drizzled out the nozzle has been made up for.

If they are sensing pressure, maybe the can put the hot end where it needs to be, put some pressure on the extruder, then raise the temp and sense when it starts to flow.

 

I hope that they release the PRUSlicer version as soon as they can so that we can do some test slices to see how it will work.

Posted : 26/11/2021 4:02 pm
Thejiral
(@thejiral)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

Compared to the crazy amounts wasted by filament switching systmes at a 5 colour print such a mimimal priming tower wouldn't be a big deal, I would assume. But of course if they could use some trickery to get rid of the tower altogether it would be even greater.

Mk3s MMU2s, Voron 0.1...
Posted : 26/11/2021 8:25 pm
burtronix
(@burtronix)
Estimable Member
RE: Prusa XL tool changer speed vs MMU2S filament changing speed + purge

Priming in the infill space is one of those potential tricks, for layers with infill.

Posted by: @thejiral

Compared to the crazy amounts wasted by filament switching systmes at a 5 colour print such a mimimal priming tower wouldn't be a big deal, I would assume. But of course if they could use some trickery to get rid of the tower altogether it would be even greater.

 

Whatever you find to do with your hands, do with all your might!...
Posted : 28/11/2021 1:18 am
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