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Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread  

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zlice
(@zlice)
Eminent Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@nikolai-r

i'm more asking for opinion than action. people seem to talk up prusa a lot, but then at the same time say this is par for the course.
i've always had horrible experience with "pre-order" buying after kickstarter/crowd-fund methods started

already delayed twice from what i was originally told when i ordered. but everyone here seems fine with it which is weird.
no one expects more delays? no one minds being lied to? why?

This post was modified 2 years ago 2 times by zlice
Posted : 20/01/2020 6:15 pm
Nikolai
(@nikolai)
Noble Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@zlice

I think the reason is because we went through this already multiple times with PR. I see no difference to MK2, MK3, MMU2 launch. We know it will take time but at the end we will get our product and fixes. PR was always fair to me in regards to this.

Often linked posts:
Going small with MMU2
Real Multi Material
My prints on Instagram...
Posted : 20/01/2020 6:19 pm
zlice liked
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread
Posted by: @zlice

@nikolai-r

i'm more asking for opinion than action. people seem to talk up prusa a lot, but then at the same time say this is par for the course.
i've always had horrible experience with "pre-order" buying after kickstarter/crowd-fund methods started

already delayed twice from what i was originally told when i ordered. but everyone here seems fine with it which is weird.
no one expects more delays? no one minds being lied to? why?

I recommend you stop preordering if it makes you unhappy.  Insanity is when you repeat actions over and over expecting a different outcome.  This is a well-known business practice for Prusa.  You knew it before you ordered and it is all over the web.  I do not feel there were any lies.  It could be more clear, but a lie is an intention to deceive in my book so there was no lie.  

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 20/01/2020 6:36 pm
bobstro
(@bobstro)
Illustrious Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread
Posted by: @zlice

[...] i'm more asking for opinion than action. people seem to talk up prusa a lot, but then at the same time say this is par for the course.

My opinion is that you're working yourself into a frenzy over factors that nobody has any control over. Prusa tries to communicate accurate information, but they are subject to unpredictable factors just like anybody else. I've yet to make it through a workday without unexpected interruptions, and I don't have to deal with personnel, calendars, inventory, shipping or supply chain issues. Stuff takes time. Stuff done right takes a bit more time sometimes. Issuing minute-by-minute updates isn't going to speed things up and will only further complicate the process.

Prusa produces amazing printers. There's a reason they're top rated, and the Mini looks to carry on that reputation. Frustration and impatience on your part do not constitute a deficiency in their product. Yes, it's frustrating, but you have to wait in line for concerts, put down payments on Teslas and many similar inconveniences in life. We do so because what you get is worth the wait. The frustration is what we have control over.

Waiting for my Mk3, I spent the 90 days learning Fusion 360 and reading up on 3D printing in general. I made a point of not checking the status page daily and was pleasantly surprised one day to get a shipping notice.

You can choose to be as miserable and upset as you want. What you can't do is complain and have it make any difference in delivery times. It sucks. Welcome to adulting.

i've always had horrible experience with "pre-order" buying after kickstarter/crowd-fund methods started

already delayed twice from what i was originally told when i ordered. but everyone here seems fine with it which is weird.
no one expects more delays? no one minds being lied to? why?

Because we're not overly dramatic about it. Anybody who wants to can follow along with the status pages and announcements. If you feel you've been lied to, you don't trust the company. Don't do business with companies you don't trust. Cancel your order and move on.

 

My notes and disclaimers on 3D printing and miscellaneous other tech projects
He is intelligent, but not experienced. His pattern indicates two dimensional thinking. -- Spock in Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan...
Posted : 20/01/2020 7:00 pm
JoanTabb
(@joantabb)
Moderator
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Please play nicely.

Nobody benefits from abusive posts. 

Regards Joan  

I try to make safe suggestions,You should understand the context and ensure you are happy that they are safe before attempting to apply my suggestions, what you do, is YOUR responsibility. Location Halifax UK...
Posted : 20/01/2020 7:15 pm
Sfbrain liked
James
(@james-10)
Eminent Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread
Posted by: @zlice

@charles-h13

someone was told "there are no issues with the mini" (@mwittm1 apparently)
myself and others were told they'd get theirs by end of jan and everything will be "on time"

Every shipping table they've put out has said "The dates are only an estimation and rely on the actual production. We're doing our best but please be aware that it can shift up to one extra week for the lead time. Or we can positively surprise and ship a bit sooner."

The early shipping info was even more vague saying the dates were just estimates.

Posted : 20/01/2020 7:29 pm
zlice
(@zlice)
Eminent Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@charles-h13

i don't know where you got this from.
i don't pre-order often at all. i did not know this was standard when i ordered. and we were lied to, like i said, being told there's no issues or delays and then a notice that there's fixes and delays.

@bobstro

yes i'm getting a bit mad not knowing if there will be more delays or issues. but now i feel like i'm more mad that people are being antagonizing, saying boo hoo, claiming i'm complaining to hurrying things up like a moron.

trust - exactly what i'm getting at. all i wanted to know is others' opinions about the situation.

Posted : 20/01/2020 8:00 pm
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@zlice

I don't know how you were lied to.  They have been upfront and honest with me when they answer questions.  I doubt they are purposely deceptive.

My advice to you is if you have no canceled your order, do so.  Buy a creality and you will soon be back ordering and happy to wait.  

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 20/01/2020 8:12 pm
bobc
 bobc
(@bobc)
Reputable Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Personally I am not bothered by the delay. I have plenty of other things to do. I was expecting there to be a high demand, and a significant lead time. I think the longest I waited for a KickStarter was something like 9 months. The best thing is to place the order and then forget about it. Checking daily for progress is a classic way to build stress.

In this type of product area, I would certainly expect teething issues. There are problems you just don't discover until you have built many products. I think PR have handled things about as well as I would expect for a small company.

Posted : 20/01/2020 8:12 pm
zlice liked
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread
Posted by: @bobcousins

Personally I am not bothered by the delay. I have plenty of other things to do. I was expecting there to be a high demand, and a significant lead time. I think the longest I waited for a KickStarter was something like 9 months. The best thing is to place the order and then forget about it. Checking daily for progress is a classic way to build stress.

In this type of product area, I would certainly expect teething issues. There are problems you just don't discover until you have built many products. I think PR have handled things about as well as I would expect for a small company.

 

Concur.  I am still waiting on several Kickstarters after years.  

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 20/01/2020 8:15 pm
zlice
(@zlice)
Eminent Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread
@charles-h13

i don't know how else to explain it without repeating what i've already said, sorry

@bobcousins

i would be that chill if they straight up said in the first couple weeks of jan "hey we got issues, there will be delays, sorry". i completely understand the issues and fixing them before hand. it's the right thing to do. but telling multiple people they'll have their order in a week and then pushing it back when there were known issues that would cause delays is sad to see.

Posted : 20/01/2020 8:17 pm
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

@zlice

The prior history od delays are all over the internet for you to read.  

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Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 20/01/2020 8:19 pm
sjrocky
(@sjrocky)
Eminent Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Hey! Lets get on to the important stuff!!! Has there been any updates to the spreadsheet? Any one receive shipping notices since the announcement?

Posted : 20/01/2020 9:15 pm
RetroBill
(@retrobill)
Estimable Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

Did they resume shipping printers today?

Posted : 20/01/2020 9:26 pm
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cEUO-8AQevqBbD37C25bSPWbb3Lpk6q_-WZuZ0HOIOY/edit#gid=0

 

Reposted link.  No changes that I can see.  

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 20/01/2020 9:42 pm
zlice
(@zlice)
Eminent Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

would you really go around trying to dig up on a company that's been around who people praise?

Posted : 20/01/2020 10:54 pm
bobstro
(@bobstro)
Illustrious Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread
Posted by: @zlice

would you really go around trying to dig up on a company that's been around who people praise?

Uhm... what does that mean?

Prusa originally said the first batch would ship in December. It did. They said there would be delays thereafter. There have been. The delays have been adjusted to account for correcting problems and improving the product. Surely you want those improvements and corrections to be incorporated when you receive yours, don't you? Unlike most of the low-cost brands, Prusa will delay and fix things. That's part of the value proposition, not a deception. At worst one could complain about delays (of a few days usually) between updates, but they're pretty busy trying to get orders out, so I think their priorities are appropriate. Hand holding takes time and costs money. Let them get the printers out as quickly as they can. If you wait, you'll be happy. If not, you can order a cheap clone and wait days between emails back from support. Take your pick.

My notes and disclaimers on 3D printing and miscellaneous other tech projects
He is intelligent, but not experienced. His pattern indicates two dimensional thinking. -- Spock in Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan...
Posted : 20/01/2020 11:01 pm
burtronix liked
zlice
(@zlice)
Eminent Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

it was a response to charles about me not knowing they do user beta-testing every printer.

Posted : 20/01/2020 11:12 pm
cwbullet
(@cwbullet)
Illustrious Member
Topic starter answered:
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

My only point was I took 30-60 minutes to research Prusa before I ordered my first printer.  I watched videos on YouTube, read articles on the internet, and read this forum.  In less than an hour, I found enough to know the history of wait times with Prusa.  

A lot of folks love to bellyache on the forum about the business practices of Prusa but it is all talk.  The only action you have to change the practice is cancel your order.  Few actually do that.  

 

--------------------
Chuck H
3D Printer Review Blog...
Posted : 20/01/2020 11:34 pm
bobc and vbl liked
Julian
(@julian-3)
Trusted Member
RE: Unofficial Prusa Mini Wait Thread

I have to say, I'm happy to (accidentally?) have bought a halfway matured product from Prusa as my first machine (MK3, later upgraded to MK3S), else I might also have developed a different view on Prusa.

But this way, I think I was able to see what Prusa is about. They're one of the biggest innovators. This does not mean they always throw perfectly polished, tested-and-true products on the market. Some of their innovations turn out to not be mature enough yet (*cough* MMU *cough*). But they are committed to continuously improving their products. Prusa is definitely not the company you go to when you want a product that "just works" and produces good results even when operated by a braindead person. There are other manufacturers who serve that market - with the downside of insane prices and sometimes lack of customization.

Prusa I would say is a tad bit better than a random kickstarter project in that they already got the machinery working. You do not risk losing your money to a failed business plan. But you still have no certainty if your investment is "worth it", or if the promised product is delivered on time. You do have the certainty that you get the product eventually, and that they make things right when (not if) flaws are found.

And you do have the chance to enjoy and make use of some actual innovations. I for example could not imagine buying another printer that does not have a print bed with magnetic PEI sheets. Not many printers have interchangeable build plates. Even less have a good material for the build plate that does not require you to use McGyver-esque methods to make the filament stick to it. You support an innovator with the money and not a plain copycat. You help advancing the technology, which, generally speaking, is still in a very early stage.

Prusa is still a startup. You unfortunately apparently didn't realize this beforehand and the consequences it brings. Expecting a "traditional" industry like e.g. smartphones and a traditional "known brand", you sure were disappointed by Prusa.

Your best bet to get quick satisfaction might be to cancel the Mini preorder and get a MK3S instead. They have pretty accurate lead times for it as it's been in production for a while already, and it's a very mature product for a 3D printer. There are printers that require less tinkering but those, as said, come at a much higher price point. The MK3S offers great value for the money provided you are willing to learn the technology in-depth, rather than just buying an appliance that magically produces physical copies of the 3D objects you feed it with.

BTW: No matter how extensively you test, there never is certainty that the product you ship is without errors. I work as a software developer and I'd say things are quite similar there too: Testing can never prove your product is free of error; it can only ever prove that your product has an error. And it will only do that for the specific things you test for. The things you do not even think about testing are the ones that will bite your ass. For hardware development, it's much harder than software. We have developed pretty good ways to simulate certain test conditions without using a lot of resources over the years, but you can't carry that over to hardware development. You can't automate most things, or at least it's not feasible.

But yes, I get the impression Prusa bit off more than they could chew with this obviously premature announcement of the Mini. That gave them a n artificial deadline when they were still in the middle of development, and artificial deadlines make people be less exact and skip things. I do think though that they have learned from the aftermath, and will announce their next product only when it's really "done-done" (= only step left is ramping up mass-production) rather than months ahead.

This post was modified 2 years ago 3 times by Julian
Posted : 21/01/2020 2:05 am
zlice, vbl, Clemens M. and 2 people liked
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